March 11, 2007

  • Pay"Pal"

    Pay“Pal” – Sodomized by a Fair-weather Friend

                 We now interrupt our regularly-scheduled programming to bring you a cautionary tale about your twin buddies eBay and Pay“Pal”, and how they turn on you when the going gets rough.  Very much like the American government, they behave in an extremely refined and civilized manner, but God help you if you haven’t read the fine print.  My manner is not quite so refined, and this post may contain some strong language that might be offensive to our younger or more effete readers.  Be forewarned.

                Our story begins when I was foolish enough to purchase a 4-gigabyte no-name  mp3 player on eBay from a merchant in Hong Kong.  The merchant had dozens of identical mp3 players listed on eBay, and his seller feedback was 100% positive at the time I made my purchase, with 98 sales to his credit at that time.  His ad oozed with unctuous concern for my customer satisfaction.  And best of all, the ad proclaimed that I was protected by PayPal Buyer Protection, free coverage up to 500 British pounds!  When I won the item for a price of 26 British pounds (a little over $52.00), I was pretty happy.  Even when the item took almost a month to arrive, my enthusiasm was relatively undiminished.

                Then I opened the package.  All of the parts were there.  But the manual, while technically in English, was utterly incomprehensible.  Here’s an example from one of the introductory bullet points:

    ·        Break to order to sow continuously: Broadcast the stop hour remembers to broadcast the position, the some song orders to a time while broadcast the some catalogue up is shut down, switch on after then park the last time of time order, Play after order to start broadcast from now on.

    As you can see, I was left very much on my own.

    Through experimentation, I managed to input a number of songs into the mp3 player, arranged in folders.  I figured out how to turn the unit on, and get it to play a song.  But I learned after much trial and error  that I couldn’t maneuver around through the folders.  The only thing I could do was to go forward to the next song or backward to the previous song.  Not terribly helpful if you have 1,000 songs and you want to skip around.

    It got worse.  I discovered that the battery would hold a charge for only an hour or two, in part because the lighted screen stayed lit all the time.  I learned that the plug-in charger wouldn’t charge the battery at all, so I had to rely on the USB cord to charge the battery.  There were other problems too numerous to mention.  Some were merely annoying but a couple, like the battery not holding a charge, were deal-killers.

    In short, the mp3 player wasn’t worth a damn.  I contacted the seller by e-mail, as eBay advised me to do, and waited several days.  No reply.  I e-mailed him again, more adamant this time.  The second time I got an automatic reply from him saying that he was swamped with orders and that he was doing the best he could to get caught up.  So I waited a few more days before deciding, as any good consumer would, to invoke the eBay Standard Purchase Protection Program.  I filed a complaint, as instructed, and was required to wait 10 days for the seller to respond before escalating the complaint to a claim.  By this time the seller was no longer a registered eBay user, and his approval rating had fallen from 100% to 84.3% in a little over a month, with 407 sales.  But I still had to wait the 10 days to allow eBay’s process to work.

    When I went back after 10 days to escalate my complaint to a claim, I discovered two things.  First, IF my claim was found to be valid, eBay would charge me a 15-pound “processing fee” – around $30.00.  This represented about 60% of the amount I had spent for the mp3 player, and meant that I would get only about $22.00 back on my $52.00 purchase.  Second, I discovered in the fine print the merest suggestion that this eBay Standard Purchase Protection Program was DIFFERENT FROM and INFERIOR TO the PayPal Buyer Protection Plan, which would pay a successful claimant up to 500 pounds sterling and charged no processing fee.  So I headed over to the PayPal web site, and spent a couple of hours printing out pages and reading all the fine print.  Let me emphasize that on the eBay web site, where I had purchased the product, there was only the slightest and most obscure mention of a PayPal Buyer Protection Plan that might be different from the eBay plan.

    Come to find out, the PayPal plan, while much more generous that the eBay plan, had a “window” of only 45 days from the date of purchase in which to file your claim.  I e-mailed the folks at PayPal and explained my situation.  If it had been a telephone conversation, it might have gone something like this:

    Me:  Hi, PayPal.  I bought this mp3 player from a merchant in Hong Kong, and it doesn’t work.  I’d like to get my money back.

    PayPal:  Has it been more than 45 days since you made the purchase, sir?

    Me:  Yes, but the merchant was in HONG KONG, and it took…

    PayPal:  Gee, we’re terribly sorry.

    Me:  …a MONTH for the item to even arrive!

    PayPal:  Has it been more than 45 days since you made the purchase, sir?

    Me:  Yes, but as I said…

    PayPal:  Then we can’t help you, sir.

    Me:   Look.  Not only did it take a month to arrive, but then I had to check the item out to see whether it worked or not, and when I found out it was a lemon, I e-mailed the merchant just like your web site says to do, and waited for his response.

    PayPal:  Has it been more than 45 days since you made the purchase, sir?

    Me:  YES, dammit!  But I’m telling you…

    PayPal:  Then I’m afraid you’re shit out of luck, sir.

    Me:  God damn it!  I wasted ten fucking days fucking around with eBay’s buyer protection plan, before discovering that it’s different from yours!  It’s not at all clear that they’re two separate plans.

    PayPal:  Our plan is clearly spelled out on our web site, sir.

    Me:  But I was on eBay’s fucking web site!  And PayPal is OWNED by eBay!  Why don’t they make it clear that there are two separate plans??

    PayPal:  I don’t know sir.  But we can’t help you.  (And here I quote PayPal’s service rep verbatim: “With millions of users, PayPal cannot make exceptions of this policy on an individual basis, as doing so would be an unfair business practice.”)

    Me:  Jesus fucking Christ!  It’s not an unfair business practice!  It’s GOOD BUSINESS!!!!

    So I was thrown back on the eBay Standard Purchase Protection Program, with its $30.00 “processing fee”.  But it looks like I’m not going to get anything from them, either.  They say they’re going to require, among other things, a “Letter of Authenticity or Appraisal” from an “independent authenticator’s physical inspection”, presumably to verify my claim that my mp3 player doesn’t work right.  I’ll probably have to ship my mp3 player to this “independent authenticator” at my own expense, which I will refuse to do.  Rather than accept a refund of about $10.00 on a $52.00 item, IF the “independent authenticator” finds that my claim has validity, I’ll keep the mp3 player for use as a very large and expensive 4-gigabyte flash drive.  It does hold data, presumably even without a functioning battery.

    Meanwhile that prick in Hong Kong is probably already back on eBay, selling more defective goods under another name.

    To add insult to injury, I attempted to withdraw the $7.95 balance that I had sitting in PayPal, drawing interest income FOR THOSE BASTARDS.  (Think about it; MILLIONS of people have cash balances sitting in their PayPal accounts, paying income TO PAYPAL.)  Come to find out, the MINIMUM I can withdraw from my OWN PayPal account is $10.00.  So I had to DEPOSIT $2.05 INTO my PayPal account, just so that I can withdraw the total amount next week sometime.

    I post this as my only recourse against eBay and PayPal.  I post to let you know in no uncertain terms that PayPal is emphatically NOT your “pal”. 

    I hope that sufficient numbers of you who read this will cease to patronize eBay and PayPal, at least enough to cost them far more than the measly $52.00 that they should have cheerfully paid me. 

    If you can’t live without eBay, then I hope that you won’t purchase anything from overseas.  And if you can’t live without the latest toy from Hong Kong, I hope I’ve helped you to become more aware of what will happen to you if a purchase goes awry, and you haven’t read all the fine print.  Or even if you HAVE read all the fine print.  As usual, caveat emptor.  Let the buyer beware.

    Me?  I don’t need eBay or PayPal that badly.  I’m shopping locally from now on.  Say what you will about Wal-Mart, they’ll generally bend their rules enough to let you return a defective item and get your money back.  They seem to understand the importance of a satisfied customer, whose word of mouth can make them or break them in the long run.

    EDIT:  I learned from one of my readers that there's an actual web site called paypalsucks.com .  While any disgruntled person can throw up a web site, it appears that quite a bit of work has gone into this one, and that a significant number of people have had far worse problems with PayPal than I have.  There's also a web site called ebaysucks.com , but it's a little more dated and less helpful.  Anyway, once again, caveat emptor.

Comments (71)

  • This is not the first time I have heard of such crap on eBay. Me - I will not buy anything online. I am not one much for shopping anyway. But my mother-in-law had hassles with them a while back over a DVD set she purchased. They are not formatted for the US. It would have been nice if they had mentioned somewhere that they were PAL DVDs that will only work in the UK and places like NZ and Australia but NOT America...unless you have a multizone player which is - for the most part - illegal here? She spent a good couple of months dicking around trying to get her money back on that one. And I think one of the girls I work with just had some trouble too but I can't remeber what her issue was now.

  • hmm

    something to look into

  • This just sucks John! I'm sorry this happened to you. Want me to turn the guy from Ebay into a toad? ~Ribbet  Ribbet~

    :::Hugs:::

  • I agree 100%. I've had my share of ebay and paypal horror stories. I use ebay to find good used books or obscure things only within the US. I never make large purchases anymore. The bright side is that you only lost 52.00 ...it could have been much worse!

  • i dont really buy things online, so i have no horror stories to tell. christopher even stopped me from donating money to dmv via paypal, although i still ended up sending the guy a computer -- which he still has, by the way. sigh.

    by the way, you never comment anymore. unless i comment you first. very nice.

  • ryc: i'm like daniel? HA. tell him that. puhleaze. i think he'd find that so insulting that he'd turn even more bastardly and misanthropic, and i'd love to see that.

    besides, my point was that i only keep the friends that are worth it. i won't be chummy with idiots just for the sake of being chummy.

  • Sounds like a  tangled web for sure! I also rarely buy things online,usually, only used books. I sit back and watch as various family members go through hell with their purchases...usually electronics. And as you say,there is almost never any recourse! Hope you are doing ok otherwise! Take care.

  • I've never bought anything from eBay. I have, though, used Amazon but only to send gifts. No problems on my end (thank GOD).

  • It's a crap shoot, to be sure.  I have successfully bought some few items from Hong Kong and Singapore.  With the knowledge that just as if I had bought the items on vacation there, upon arrival home I owned them, for good or for ill.  Sigh.  I will only buy electronics from a retail store.  With me nailing down any loopholes in the extended warranty.

  • I've never used e-bay before although I have a couple of good friends who buy things on there regularly - don't think ever from overseas though.  One of my brothers works at Paypal and a friend of mine too - not that they make the policies or anything .

    Got my mp3 at Nebraska Furniture Mart for $85 - it's nothing fancy, but it works well and for as much as I use it I'd say I've definitely gotten my money's worth out of it.

    Walmart is bad - don't shop there.

  • HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...I'm so sorry, but your conversation with PayPal was just too funny. I still have an open account with them...in the amount of $8.49. I don't shop on ebay since they charged me an outragous amount for a an ad I placed to sell an antique dining set....which didn't sell.

  • yeah.  been there, john.  they suck.

  • Jeshua would be that dorky looking kid who posted the first comment on that blog. :) If you check out his site, there's a pic of us on his banner, along with a tulip he got me. (Oh, we're kinda dating.)

    And I haven't changed those things in forever! All my links were made about a year and a half ago and are lyrics from Hawthorne Heights songs.

  • ryc: yeah i try to update daily. sometimes it's hard, but i mostly enjoy it. especially of late. :) as for oncalls, what are they you ask?...uh, i work for a HHCA, and since its in the medical field SOMEONE has to be oncall 24/7, and my coworker & i take turns doing that. :) hope that answers your question. and i hope you have a lovely day. :)

  • We had one experience of buying a video plug for our Mac from Hong Kong, where the merchandise was dubious (i.e. it works only intermittently). I decided then and there to never use eBay to buy anything from overseas. I've had good luck with purchases from US sellers.

  • I used to buy from Ebay a couple times a week and I've never had a problem from anyone in a foreign country.  Then I made the mistake of setting up a PayPal account and my Ebay has been screwed up ever since.  And I've noticed lots of my sellers say they won't accept PayPal anymore.  I'm sorry you got ripped off.  Some people will think it's only $52.00, but I look at it that ITS FIFTY TWO BUCKS!!

  • RYC: That's fair.  When was the last time we had an actual honest politician there to serve the people?  Canada doesn't have one in parliament at the moment.  Gore and Obama are the only two in the Republic that come close to being genuine.  I had hopes for Hillary, but something about her always bugged me.  I had my suspicions about her...  well... not confirmed, but justified.

    There isn't a single candidate on the Republican ticket that I can say with a straight face can be trusted.  Basically the question I'm asking is "Which candidates are most likely to start arresting people in the US government and military for war crimes commited?".

    I'm feeling better, btw.  Get well wishes are always nice, even if I am in a slightly foul mood.  And yes Kat does visit my site.  We even have a chat on AIM once in a blue moon.    She's good people.  You should add me to your AIM as well!

    Oh...  Ebay/Paypal are evil.  They're not evil by intent, but the end result of dehumanizing their dealings and focusing solely on their bottom line is by nature very bad.  That pretty much goes for any corporation.

  • iPod Nano is garbage, too.  Sounds basically like what you got, except...  your was a tad worse.

  • ryc: she has been talking about a puppy (basset hound) for weeks now, more so in the past week, guess that's why i've thought of it. so i think if i get it for her she'll like it. :) though she HATES the dog we have now. but she didnt want him to begin with , and he is mine, and i love him to pieces!! :)

  • Sorry this happened. I regret much that I bought my current motorscooter from ebay. By the time shipping was added, the savings were hardly worth it. And I have no way to know if they set back the odometer, for it has always needed to be adjusted and tuned more than the exact model I had before which shouldn't be happening if it was received with the mileage the odometer said. For everything else, ebay has served me.

  • ryc: oh, do tell what this "long list" consists of. i'm curious as to what you know about either of us that's more than just surface observations, actually.

  • ryc: whichever you prefer. neither way holds any benefits over the other, to me.

  • sorry you got took but i dont trust buying anything on line well i hope you have a wonderful wensday

  • actually, those pictures are from tuesday, tuesday was good until i found out about my dad, i'm terribly stressed but there's nothing to do about it, so i just try to cheer myself up.

  • No, my old man's a bitter Italian chef.

    I'm not technically a townie; I just go to community college.

  • I'm sorry you had such a rotten and frustrating experience with eBay.  And thank you for sharing it as a cautionary tale.  I've never purchased anything from eBay, (and based on your tale, I don't think I ever will, either), but I have purchased lots of stuff online from reputable dealers like Lands End, Eddie Bauer, and Amazon, and I haven't had any problems with them yet.

  • I quit ebay a couple of years ago.  Too many opportunities to get fleeced.

    RYC: never discount the value of good, clean debauchery.  My people are mostly anglo and germanic.  Not too many Scots in the woodpile.  Great place, though.

  • I've used Paypal (and Ebay) before and thus far, no problems. But I've been the lucky few. I'm so sorry that you had to go through so much to get the customer service you deserve. Bottom line is this: Stay away from overseas Ebay sellers and always make sure their ratings are 99-100% for customer service. It also helps when you see that they've been in business for a while. Hope your next online shopping experience is better! (Random blogger here)

  • RYC

    No I have decided that I started the last fight. The fact that you fight dirty was something i would never have known if I had been nice about. And more than one person told me you were really a nice guy and that I should not have jumped on you like that.

    You have friends here and my grudges are normally short lived. There is only one person I was involved in a political argument with I will not forgive. That ass believed every word he said and has no redeeming features about him. And I was nice to him.

  • Oh good Lord. Please don't tell me that mp3 player was a Sansa.

  • I have never bought anything on ebay.  And this post pretty much assured that I won't.

  • ryc: you sound a lot like me. I think if I were more "successful", I'd be hitting all the school reunions (there have been a couple already) being absolutely lovely, but going "hey, look how well I'm doing!" Unfortunately, things didn't work out that way, and I still have the anger and nothing to show for it. I gotta work through that. Maybe in time for the 25th anniversary, that gives me a cushion of well over a decade...

    I got a little nervous because your description of the mp3 player sounded almost like mine (I have a Sandisk Sansa). I'm so sorry you went through this with Ebay and Paypal. You really take a risk with those sellers, I guess. I haven't ordered too much from Ebay for just that reason.

  • ryc:  you know, i can't say i'm all that surprised. you'd think that anyone who truly wants to terrorize us would go for the jugular. (did i spell that right? hmm, it doesn't look right...)  anyhow, it definitely DOES cause me to pray.  but i refuse to live in "terror,"  just with caution.

  • My nephew lost a few thousand dollars buying MP3 players on eBay.I never had any problems that were not resolved,but I do not buy overseas much,usually England if at all.
    What songs were you loading?? I love to look thru people's music collections,it is amazing to see all the types of music out there...I have all my albums and 45's from growing up and someone who use to own jukeboxes gave me a lot of old Swing 45's that I love to play!

  • And that's why I absolutely refuse to use Ebay for items that I can get from stores. Or even make online purchases of things that I know are sitting in the Best Buy down the street.
    Also, never, ever, EVER trust electronics from the Far East that aren't obviously some kind of name brand. Too late, I know, but just a general principle of mine.

  • Yup ,he was supposed to be getting a good deal and wanted to resell them,I was first on the list to get one for $30.
    I listen to the radio station out of Temple Univ.http://www.wrti.org/about/faq.htm

  • ryc:  i'm getting my master's in social work with a certificate in gerontology. Any green beers for you tonight?

  • Following up with what I wrote on 3/13/07, the motorscooter that I had bought on ebay 11/04 not only costed more than buying it locally after shipping, but it is cursed. I'm planning on buying a replacement tomorrow via a contact I visited from Craigslist, and getting rid of the aforementioned scooter, fearing that it is cursed, for it has been nothing but problems.

  • You would be shocked at how intelligent other humans can be. Especially humans that would be news conscious enough to have found that video clip and enjoyed it.

    The truly ignorant are not those that watch a news source you don't like. Its those that pay no attention to any sources at all and they are the majority. But then watching any TV nightly news cast on its own, leaves you very poorly informed, but sadly thinking that you do know something.

  • hahahahahahahahahaha, , , sorry about your loss, , , but you have to admit, , , the story is worth the expense isnt it?  i use pay pal, , , they have a good interest rate and their card has come in handy, , , altho it doesnt appear to work in mexico.

    as far as chinese goods, , , and ebay, , , i have never bought anything from ebay nor will i in the foreseeable future, , , or any future. china is notorious for imitation products.  i considered making a deal a year or so ago in mexico for buying imitation cigarettes out of mexico city to sell at my store in nuevo laredo, , , but the connection got lost.  (i was going to test them before i sold any)  i was told i could get them for about $2 a carton and i sold them for $2 a pack, , , a good markup.

    smokes are one thing, , , they were probably nasty, , , things with moving parts or electronic parts i think would be something else, , , i would automatically think anything ordered direct out of china would contain a high possibility of being imitation.  i would not have bought anything from ebay, , , even less ordered direct from china, , ,

    but, , , hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha, , , good story, , , i understood the instructions clearly, , , hahahahahahahahahahahaha, , , they said, , , you have been ripped off, , , thank you for your patronage. . .

    just remember, , , when, , , like jr, , , you say , , , you cant fool me twice, , , you should mean it. . .  unlike jr.

  • hahahaha, , , i laugh a lot dont i.  i wouldnt call it first class, , , i sleep in a van on the way up there and pay heavily for my trip, , , its a mexican business trip and my payment is i drive back to mexico in one of their purchases, , , sometimes non stop or with a 3, , , max 4 hour sleep break on the way back on the side of the road, , , its about a 24 hr drive.  i sometimes wonder why i even go with them, , , i do have some friends up there i like to visit with.

    they are on the route tho, , , i do not have the luxury of diversion from the course and the bunch i ride with always take the same route, tx,ark,tenn,ky, with clarksville being the end of the line, , , and no time to stop. . . the people i do get a chance to visit with work at the car auctions we go to.  i do no work, , , but i am limited to being where the work is.  i would in fact like to stop by and say hi.

    muslims keep saying that, , , but kerny kept saying he had a plan as well, , , i did attempt to discover what his plan was but failed at every attempt, , , i have also sought evidence what muslims say is true, , , i have yet to find evidence of it as well, , , other than the statement itself.  maybe im being overly careful.  it has served me in the past.

    im sure you are right about headline news, , , but , , , i was still in mexico at the time and i could have easily missed news from the us, , , i seem to still miss a lot, , , i did buy a radio, , , not from ebay, , , i got it at wal mart, but i keep forgetting to turn it on.

    ill stop by and check on her.

  • Wow, sorry you had a problem there. I've been selling and buying on Ebay, and sometimes using PayPal for years. PayPal and eBay are both fine as long as there ARE NO PROBLEMS. After that, it is completely and totally up to you to solve it, because they aren't going to help. Those supposed Hong Kong merchants are mostly ripoffs. Check out the jewelry they sell online on eBay. Most of it is junk (hence why you can buy a five carat sapphire ring for $20, only to find out it is a man made sapphire, and not a good one).

    I had only one case where I was ripped off, and eventually, because it was a US seller who basically did the same thing as your Hong Kong guy did, he ended up in jail. The US Attorney got involved and the guy ended up getting a 10 year sentence. But again, that was with NO help from eBay whatsoever. Even when they knew the guy was ripping off people, they allowed him to keep his ID for yet another two weeks (and countless auctions).

    I know this doesn't give you any help at all, but be glad that the money you lost wasn't more than $52. And don't ever deal with anyone offshore online!

  • ryc: i still don't really care. if anything, it'd be amusing, so go ahead.

  • As with my school, we have to order our books online and have them shipped to us. Most of my textbooks have come from Half.com which is part of eBay. I will do my best not to use them but there are no guarantees. May be Barnes-n- Noble have a better deal than them. I have also had some problems with the dealers but I have gotten my money. I hope it all works out for you in the long run. May the revolt begin!

  • ryc: who is my best friend/worst enemy?  or did you mean them as two entities?

  • I will pass this along to my husband, who ebays incessantly. I decline to for many reasons, but now I have another one. RYC: Your neighbor is everyone else. Thanks for dropping by.

  • There is nothing perjorative about stating facts. I can disagree with the way people do things and still 'love' them.

  • RYC: I think I know what is freezing your computer. I'm going to remove it. As for the the main gist of your comment...I think you are right on target. The rest I'll have to comment about privately.

  • i started to say, , , "not to be bragging, but"  but it is more bragging, , , you would not be the first to drive a long way for one of my hamburgers, , , well, , , i wouldnt be there making it, , , but i taught them everything they know.  and no, , , im not a restaurant chef, , , honest johns was my first shot at a cafe.  i just remembered what a hamburger was supposed to taste like before mcdonalds and wendys.

    if you want mayo on yours, , , dont ask for a hamburger, , , those are called sissy burgers where i come from, , , ketchup is reserved for kids who like it with their fries.  and my hamburgers should come with a warning lable.  i call it my trademark, , , but really its the way hamburgers used to be made, , , the bun is toasted with grease on the top to hold the salt to it.

    you can of course special order one to be made as a tasteless piece of stomach filling, , , but if you just order a hamburger, , , you will get one.  with mustard on both parts of the bun, , , and more than one pickle, , , and of course the other stuff.

    i think they are better business people than me tho, , , the most frequent complaint i got was my portions were too big for the people to eat.

    they are planning on a little more fancy, , , my origional menu during the day, , , and part of it, , , its a big place, , , to make it into one of those reservation only places.  some of those have done pretty good way out in the middle of nowhere.

  • caveat emptor....Let the buyer beware...
    I  am blog hopping,wanted to say hi.

  • well you spell better then everyone especially me i think its nice that you think im precious i dont think a guy has ever said that to me before ( sorry if i got to deep), how have you been. stay blessed

  • you may be right, , , i cant be a judge of that, , , i have no depression, , , sometimes i just get tired tho.  i have never been able to visualize depression.

    and no, , , and yes, , , but not really.  that wouldnt help anything.  it should be stricktly controlled and given out free by the govt. to who wants it. (meaning addicts)  hundreds of times cheaper than housing offenders in state run facilities, all drugs could be bought until we could produce our own at a mind blowing discount from all the mexican drug cartels, , , buy it all, , , no need for them to fight any longer, , , and the price right now as it stands is pennys on the hundreds of dollars street price. 

    dealers would have no business, burglaries and robberies to support a $300 a day habit would stop instantly, , , and since you would be noted as a drug addict, , , to recieve free drugs, , , i believe the demand for drugs would drop quite a lot.  and if not, , , like i said, , , the cost would be a fraction for what we are paying, , , and the addicts are paying , , , and the victims of burglaries and robberies are paying today.

    this could be refined, , , but it is just common sense.

  • From yesterday:  I looked up the word 'pejorative' because sometimes I think I know what a word means but then I decide maybe I really don't.  So I look it up.  After reading the actual definition, I suppose you could apply it to my comment.  Thank you for furthering my education.

  • ryc: oh, i wouldn't know what his score is on any other day. to be honest, even on our worst days, i'd only ever count up his 'points' in fun.

  • RYC; I agree with you 100 %, John. I just held back on a full committment to what you stated in case the soldier was lying. I too hate seeing the innocents of any race get killed.

    But the soldier sounded truthful, and I believe he was following the training he was given. Ill-prepared, but you know the people responsible won't be offering their neck up for chopping.

    You never need to hold back when speaking of what you referred to as "sounding like a broken record." At mybaddy, you're preaching to the choir. :)

    Once again George and Dick escape from the mess... and the soldier that heads overseas trusting them, now feels the weight of military court coming down on him.

    THEY should have been the ones being investigated; not just in this case, but for quite awhile now.

    Peace

    Scott

  • I know a way to get back at 'em. Never use them again. That'll show them.

  • Thank you for the warning, I am a bit naive on this subject

  • Yes i know that, but it was fun to not bring it up.

    You can't combine them and use strait math. Any combinations would need to researched as separate items with their own odds

  • Hi John! Thank you so much for your kind words regarding my brother's passing. I really appreciate it.  You write so well so this "random blogger" will definitely be visiting more often ^_^  Thanks again about this warning about Paypal. Personally I've never had any problems with it (perhaps I'm the lucky few) but I'll be sure to be on the lookout for

    RYC: You think too highly of me, but thank you. My ego is very happy now! ^o~ I'm a Bio-Chem student but I don't have a clue as to what I want to do when I graduate from university this year.  I put my future plans on the shelf when my brother got sick, so now I don't know where I'll be heading. But I guess that's why they call Life a journey.

  • I've been very impressed with Barack Obama both at the Oakland event, and hearing him interviewed on Larry King Live. He holds his own and speaks from the heart both in the speech venue and the interview. I don't think he was pandering anything on Larry King's, just calling it as he sees it, somewhat creating it spontaneously as he goes along. Contrast that to how scripted Hillary is .... that video wouldn't have multiplied so quickly if Hillary wasn't actually just like Big Brother from 1984, in form anyways.

  • RYC: I know its crazy, when I heard it was found in Lake Superior I was shocked!! It's a miracle the bottle survived after all these years.

  • I would be intersted to see where I ever said that ALL muslims should be annihilated. You actually make broad assumptions yourself which are judgmental. FYI, my sister converted to Islam, my sister in law is married to a muslim and I have many friendships in our muslim community...one reaching 20 years. We have animated and interesting conversations and yet seem to be able to keep rancor out of the equation. Try it sometime, you might like it.

  • what a fiasco!  i'm glad i've never had a problem.

    would you like to join my blogring?  i'd be honored to have you!

  • soory to hear about your expericence with ebay and paypal. my doctor did check for a thyroid problem and i dont have that either to me its strange but w/e aleast im not dieing thanks for keeping me in your thoughts and prayers. yes i do do most of my "online stuff" after school b/c i have nothing else to do. stay blessed and have a good weekend

  • *waves* hi. hope all is well with you. :) oh and as for paypal i know nothin bout them . hows ya doin? miss ya updates.

  • John, you have uttered what I almost always feel about my posts. Could have been stated more clearly.  This one in particular was that way.  I guess I wanted to "back-up" my claims and as a result went just a bit in circles.  You are so right about people asking for forgiveness.  We tend to apologize once in a while but how often do we really say "will you forgive me?"  Almost never.  Good thoughts.

    Tim

  • ok i will try to exercise more does walking home from school
    count as exercise? stay blessed

  • "Is blood the ONLY currency of freedom? Can freedom ever be achieved through negotiation, through mutual respect, through "live and let live"?"

    unfortunatly, , ,you nor i can set the rules.  and i believe history has shown us blood is indeed the only currency of freedom.  it was never won through negotiation, , , the only option for negotiation  is for the victim country to surrender, , , which negates freedom.  there is a reason for initiating violence towards another community / country.  whatever that reason may be , , , in the current case to assert islams influence world wide, , , negotiation is usless.

    you must convert to islam or enslave yourself to them, or die.  i know thats a far stretch, , , but thats the way they translate their scriptures, , , the religion of peace, , , the peaceful part, , , (i wish our peaceful part were the same) is to merely keep silent and not denounce the ones taking action.  the religion of peace (the peaceful part) has not uttered a word to stop the part who is not so peaceful. 

    some may have made a few empty statements to us to hold back our aggression towards their aggresiveness, , , but that also is covered in their religion. . . it is ok to lie to your enemy, , , which it is, , , i agree.  the enemy does not have to believe them, , , i dont.

    look, , , i am too old and broken to fight anyone, , , i have 2 sons who are neither, i have 4 daughters who are neither.  i would not like to see them go to war.

    nor would i like to see them live in slavery.

    not trying to start an arguement here, , , but in historys opinion, and my opinion, , , there is no other currency, , , no.

    "And, with regard to the film itself, did you know that it was done mostly through animation? Not the human characters themselves, but the sets, the background."

    hahahahaha, , , sure, , , that would be a whole lot of actors to hire, , , and i think its illegal to push elephants off cliffs, etc, etc, etc, in order to make a movie.  nor was it accurate, , , i mean, , , what was the year?  something bc i believe.  dan rather could not have been there and if there was anyone documenting it, , , i think the documentation has long been destroyed.

    what evidence could have been collected in the 9/11 incident has long been destroyed, , , and that is relatively recent activity, , , i mean, , , i have never even seen evidence a plane actually hit the pentagon, , , i saw the hole in the wall and everything else everyone else saw.  but i never saw a piece of a plane, , , did you?

    why was nothing found at the world trade center except a passport and a note?  come on.  cant find nothing in a humongus pile of rubble but a passport and a note of intent, , , , , hahahahahahahahaha.

    muslims also fight amongst themselves, , , it is a quest for world power but also for jockying for position, , , similar to republicans and democrats, , , a little more violent, but the same.  islam was involved in 9/11. . . not necessarily the same ones the finger was pointed at. and not necessarily working alone.

    there are those among us, , , not me, , , not you, , , who would assist them in their quest for the promise of wealth and power.  of course those are fools, , , they are the ones falling for the aforementioned lies.

  • im glad walking home counts i do that like everyday. yes i have had my blood checked and im all fine thanks for wondering. stay blessed

  • Very cleverly written even though your situation sucks. I'd probably try the ebay way simply because some money back is better than none. I haven't ebayed in years.

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